Comments on: Meat Market Blogging

By: madisonian.net » The Toy Story Approach to Faculty Hiring

madisonian.net » The Toy Story Approach to Faculty Hiring — Fri, 13 Oct 2006 18:34:59 +0000

[...] The legal blaw-cademy is again brimming with advice in anticipation of the all-too-soon AALS Faculty Recruitment Conferece, universally known as the meat market. I’ve chimed in on this topic before (and here). In this post I want to reiterate only one point. From what I wrote about a year ago: Despite the fact that this is a ruthlessly competitive environment, be courteous to absolutely everyone you meet. In the best of all worlds, you will get the law faculty appointment of your dreams, and you can put the meat market unpleasantness safely behind you. Still, your scholarly reputation across the profession will begin at the Marriott Wardman. You will encounter many of your interviewers and many of your fellow candidates in the future, as colleagues at other law schools. Give each of them every reason to respect you when they see you or hear about you again. [...]

By: Brett Frischmann

Brett Frischmann — Wed, 09 Nov 2005 23:00:20 +0000

Oh yeah, and have fun!

Seriously, the whole process can be enjoyable if you have the right mindset.

By: The Unknown Professor

The Unknown Professor — Tue, 08 Nov 2005 21:33:12 +0000

Nice advice. Most of it’s definitely applicable to other subfields. I’d particularly stress #3 – most academic sub-fields are pretty small, so everyone knows everyone. Come off like a jerk, and word spreads pretty fast.

On the other hand, handle things well, and you could find yourself making contacts that stay with you for years to come. I just had an interview at our recent national conference that came about because of my friendship with a faculty member that was a “competitor” several years ago when I first “came out”. We both got good jobs, and he’s now one of my closest friends.

So it pays to be nice.

By: Ann Bartow

Ann Bartow — Tue, 08 Nov 2005 16:49:48 +0000

But isn’t a “shoulder bag” that is large enough to accomodate your CV and reprints (without squashing them), along with personal crap, and publications you are given by interviewers, pretty much a briefcase? And doesn’t a briefcase do a better job of signaling “I am one of you” to a roomful of mostly men than a purse? I’m guessing you’ve never interviewed for a job as a women, though feel free to correct me if I am mistaken on this point :>)

By: Brett Frischmann

Brett Frischmann — Tue, 08 Nov 2005 16:34:21 +0000

I think 2-B is quite important actually. Not only should you listen for cues about the school, but you should act like an active and informed buyer as well. Do not go overboard; you do not want to be perceived as overconfident. But don’t be afraid to ask questions and make comments that reflect an awareness that you are looking for a school that fits your needs and interests. I think this also sends the “I am one of you already” message as well.

By: Mike Madison

Mike Madison — Tue, 08 Nov 2005 16:14:41 +0000

I'll plead guilty to idiosyncrasy but not to sexism. Read the post again: Shoulder bags are just fine, because there are good reasons to want to lug paper around, and I'm not talking purses (which are also fine, but are often not convenient for piles of paper). The point isn't sartorial (matching shoes? I don't care. I also have no opinions on hair length, eyeglasses v. contacts, nail polish, earrings (for men or women), or facial hair.). The sole point was, and is, that nonverbal cues may send an "I'm one of you already" message. I wrote about this earlier. Be the ball.

By: Ann Bartow

Ann Bartow — Tue, 08 Nov 2005 15:13:21 +0000

What are you feelings about matching your bag with your shoes? Yeesh, Madison! It’s hard to find women’s suits with pockets big enough for wallets and keys, so most women need to tote something, and a briefcase is nice and gender neutral, plus as Hoffman correctly points out, it gives you a handy place to store (and hide) the printed material you accumulate throughout the day.

By: Joe Liu

Joe Liu — Mon, 07 Nov 2005 13:58:22 +0000

Great advice. Re: point number 2 – this may also be idiosyncratic, but I would put this even more strongly: if you have spent 10-15 minutes talking about pleasantries or your CV without getting to academic substance, some warning lights should be going off in your head.

It’s certainly possible that the school is so taken by your record that they are in pure sell mode. However, if that isn’t the case, then an interview that doesn’t touch on your academic interests won’t give them an adequate basis for calling you back, even if it’s not your fault that the interview went that way.

Sometimes, for whatever reason (e.g. interpersonal dynamics, fatigue, lack of social skills, etc.), interviewers may not get to the substantive materials that they care most about. If 10-15 minutes have passed, you should probably try to steer the conversation gently to your substantive interests. In other words, don’t be passive.

Of course, you need to do this tactfully. Don’t charge in, ignore their questions, and start talking about your most recent paper. For the first several minutes, let the interview develop its own rhythm, etc. But after about 10 minutes or so, if your academic interests haven’t yet come up, start looking for opportunities to raise the issue. (E.g. “Actually, that touches on one of my current research interests …”). If they still show no interest, then maybe this is a pure selling interview, but at least you gave them an opportunity to engage.

By: Mike Madison

Mike Madison — Mon, 07 Nov 2005 13:09:18 +0000

Matt,
As Dave points out, it’s useful to have something to carry papers and brochures in. My point was that whatever you use, don’t use something that signals “law firm.” But I expected different views, and Dave offers one.

By: Dave Hoffman

Dave Hoffman — Mon, 07 Nov 2005 05:21:02 +0000

Great post. As you said, Tip #4 is idiosyncratic, and I think it would be a mistake for folks to go out and *buy* a shoulder bag between now and the MM if they don’t have one already. The point of having a bag is to carry around the brochures that schools give you (so it isn’t quite so obvious where you’ve been) and, if you like, a binder that you’ve made with tip sheets about who you are seeing next. I took a briefcase, I doubt anyone noticed. I still take a briefcase to class. I doubt anyone notices now either.

I agree 110% with Tip #3.